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<rindolf> This reminds me of a fun discussion I had with my co-worker.
<rindolf> He had a Firefox window open with an ActiveState page and I
read "Perl, PHP, Python, Tcl, XSLT".
<rindolf> So he said: "Heresy! C is the only language."
<rindolf> So I thought for a moment and said "Intercal is the only
language."
<nanonyme> lol
<rindolf> And then "Real men write in Intercal."
<rindolf> "COME FROM" anyone?
-- The Only Programming Language
-- #perl, Freenode
<pmurias> rindolf: what is Park/Spark?
<rindolf> pmurias:
http://www.shlomifish.org/open-source/projects/Park-Lisp/
<rindolf> pmurias: it's still incomplete.
<rindolf> And I haven't updated it.
<pmurias> rindolf: if you like lisp/perl6 projects you might consider
helping with a common lisp elf backend
<rindolf> pmurias: Common Lisp.
<rindolf> pmurias: thing is I think both CL and Scheme suck.
<rindolf> I like Lisp as a concept.
<rindolf> Arc is nice, but has too many implementation problems.
<rindolf> And missing features.
<vixey> Arc is not nice
<rindolf> I want to give a presentation to the Perl Mongers about
"Foreign Languages: Lisp"
<rindolf> vixey: I like it.
<rindolf> Though I hate that "(not)" has become "(no)"
<rindolf> it's so non-English.
<vixey> it's just TCL with horrible syntax
<rindolf> vixey: but it's missing a lot of exciting features.
<rindolf> Which PG deemed as unnecessary.
<rindolf> Doesn't look like the 100-years language to me.
<rindolf> Which is why - Spark!
<pmurias> why not just write an s-expression p6 dialect?
<rindolf> pmurias: could be.
<rindolf> pmurias: it's another approach.
<rindolf> But some things make sense in Lisp and not in p6.
<rindolf> For example, Perl does not like to use + for string or list
concat.
<rindolf> While Python does and it seems to be OK in Arc too.
<rindolf> And in CL you have (concatenate) (yuck!).
<pbuetow> (((hehe)))
<pmurias> + for strings sucks
<Auzon> seconded.
<vixey> rindolf: If you don't like CONCATENATE you can just rename it
<rindolf> vixey: yeah.
<rindolf> vixey: but I'd rather not rename concatenate because then
people won't understand my code.
<rindolf> vixey: as TimToady said people hate abstractions.
<vixey> yes they will rindolf
<rindolf> They want things to work out of the box.
<vixey> A program is many many totally newly defined procedures
<vixey> just renaming one thing is nothing in the context of a big
program
<rindolf> vixey: "let's spend 3 days creating a new language, and 1 day
implementing the solution with it."
<TimToady> if it would take 10 days without the new language, it's worth
it
<rindolf> TimToady: yeah.
<rindolf> TimToady: but this is the CL mentality.
<vixey> no it's not
<rindolf> Sometimes you can take 1 day to write an API.
<vixey> CL is too diverse you cannot generalize like that
<rindolf> vixey: I meant a common idiom there.
<rindolf> I think I'll /quit and do something productive.
<rindolf> Like work on Spark.
<vixey> another quote:
<vixey> how to write any computer program in two easy stages:
<vixey> Design and implement the programming language which would be
best for solving the problem.
<vixey> Write the program in the language you’ve just implemented.
<rindolf> vixey: or just use Perl which is the best for everything.
<vixey> heh
<TimToady> the second step is obvious--the best language for the job is
one that does the job on a null input
* pmichaud notes that vixey's algorithm is somewhat recursive
<TimToady> "All rules of thumb are false, including this one."
<pmurias> rindolf: when you feel like writing Common Lisp backends,
contact me or mncharity ;)
-- Lisp Dialects (Scheme, Common Lisp, Arc, Spark) Mentality and Usability
-- #perl6, Freenode